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Vegan People
Respecting All Animals
17th-Jun-2009 06:51 pm
Mod note- there have been two recent accusatory posts about a member of VP. They've been removed; please do not repost this again or it will be deleted and you'll have to reapply for membership.

It's not appropriate for this community.

*edit to clarify* (as posted in comments)
There's really no way for us to verify it's true, especially since I know there's a history of animosity between the two, so for all we know, it's just an attempt to defame him.

Even if it is true, this really isn't the place to post it. I can understand local listservs, but not an international blog.
17th-Jun-2009 10:56 pm (UTC)
I didn't think it was particularly appropriate to give ways of hassling/confronting him, but surely if this guy is involved in lots of activism (and until recently, was often active on this comm too), isn't it a good idea to warn people at least of who he is and that he's potentially dangerous?
17th-Jun-2009 10:58 pm (UTC)
Well, there's really no way for us to verify it's true, especially since I know there's a history of animosity between the two, so for all we know, it's just an attempt to defame him.

Even if it is true, this really isn't the place to post it. I can understand local listservs, but not an international blog.
17th-Jun-2009 11:18 pm (UTC)
I agree that 1) there wasn't exactly substantial proof (no reports that I found upon Googling) and 2) an LJ community isn't the best place for disclosing such information.

I'd like to think it's all an immature prank, but regardless...
17th-Jun-2009 11:20 pm (UTC)
Nevermind, you clarified above. Thank you.
17th-Jun-2009 11:21 pm (UTC)

Well I guess I missed something.
17th-Jun-2009 11:28 pm (UTC)
effective modding on the part of faerycake and dagda.
*round of applause*
17th-Jun-2009 11:49 pm (UTC)
once again dagda rocks
18th-Jun-2009 12:14 am (UTC)
not again.

I didn't see the posts and I know exactly who/what this is about.
18th-Jun-2009 12:15 am (UTC)
I've also been seeing bulletins about it on myspace. Go internet.
18th-Jun-2009 01:39 am (UTC)
Not for nothing but... I wanna know. I hate not knowing. What happened?
18th-Jun-2009 06:20 am (UTC)
check my livejournal.
18th-Jun-2009 04:39 am (UTC)
I nearly wore out my F5 this morning.
18th-Jun-2009 11:19 am (UTC)
Thanks for modding.
18th-Jun-2009 12:03 pm (UTC)
The fact that you are protecting this dude when various AR groups from various states over a period of time have had issues with this guy, and at least two girls have come forward SO FAR - there are probably more - is really disappointing and makes me really angry. Communities like this are where people like him can posture, build up a respectable persona, and lure unsuspecting girls in. Mods should have the interests of the community at heart. Other women who post here could have been victimized by him and would be more likely to come forward knowing that others have done the same. Women and YOUNG GIRLS that he is meeting right now, wherever he has fled to, who are potential victims of rape could post in this community, see that warning, and be aware of who they are dealing with.

It makes me so sad that when the animal rights community is coming together to find a sick person who has exploited them (and really, the animals, too) in order to have a pool of women to pick rape victims from, you are making a choice to protect this person. Yes, he has been an outspoken member of these communities and yes, he mods at least one (vegan_snark), but he uses his "popularity" (over the internet - he is not NEARLY as well liked in real life....because he's a fucking rapist) and mod status to make it easier for him to befriend and get closer to girls.

After some inappropriate comments and sketchy behavior about a year ago i had to tell him to stop contacting me, and when I first heard that these two girls had come forward, I was not at all surprised. Neither were my friends who know this guy.

I guess I'm just asking you to step up and be community mods, instead of personal bodyguards for a man who's interest is in raping the majority of your community female members. This is no longer a safe place to post if you do not allow us to protect our own here by spreading information about a dangerous predator in our midst.
18th-Jun-2009 12:07 pm (UTC)
oh, also i encourage you to contact the animal defense league in philly if you want to get more information. i'm sure they could point you in MANY directions that back up what has been posted and deleted here. the only reason i'm not reposting it now is because i'd like to stay in this community so that i can see if he posts here anymore and keep an eye out for the girls here...since no one else is interested in doing that.
(Deleted comment)
18th-Jun-2009 12:13 pm (UTC)
ah. i know what's going on. this has been a topic of discussion man times.
18th-Jun-2009 12:41 pm (UTC)
Who's going to post where to send him vegan cookies in jail?
18th-Jun-2009 12:43 pm (UTC)
aka it couldn't have happened to a nicer guy
19th-Jun-2009 05:27 pm (UTC)
I know someone else mentioned it and i'm going to have to say the same.
I didnt know what the heck was going on, and i instantly knew who it was about. Ha.
I see where the mods are coming from on this, but i agree with wefoughtharder, since that guy seems to travel everywhere, its important for everyone (esp girls) to be in the know here.
20th-Jun-2009 05:57 am (UTC)
Is anyone here actually on his side at all? or are you all shunning him now?
(Deleted comment)
(Deleted comment)
20th-Jun-2009 08:14 pm (UTC)
out of curiosity- why NOT an international blog if ryan smith clearly fled the country due to his reputation in the US being so soiled he had no where else to go?

wouldn't that mean his future victims would be perhaps [GASP] international?

i mean, come on.
20th-Jun-2009 08:15 pm (UTC)
one of the mods knows him, and knows he'd been planning a trip to europe for over a year. he didn't "flee the country".

also, when i made this post initially, i didn't know he was out of the country. if these accusations are true, the mods have decided we probably are going to post the info about him here.
22nd-Jun-2009 12:52 pm (UTC)
After reading all the comments I have to admit I really do want to leave this community and would suggest new vegans or other vegans alike not to join. I've always thought of you as a fair and good mod but the way you are acting for the community and in this thread is really alarming. Clearly there is a lot of proof and people coming forward about this situation and though I don't condone harassing him via email or whatever contact information of him was given it shouldn't be dismissed as: "well not enough proof so forget about it!" I've seen people get banned/and or defamed for far less and usually silly internet fights/ect.

This is WAY bigger. I don't think you're trying to protect him persay, but this is one of those instances where "fair mod" goes too far when it always hasn't been practiced that way.

It's really sick and this is certainly the place to post it.
22nd-Jun-2009 01:36 pm (UTC)
the mods have information from a similar claim made by veganthis in november that has given us pause because of what information came to light then and its similarity to this claim; it is why we've been looking into this more.

i and other mods have contacted other groups he's been involved with, someone he's accused of raping, and some other people who know him we've heard back from several of them, and since we still have no idea as to his innocence or guilt, we're currently discussing disclosing what info we have collected and asking members to make their own decision, taking into account that this is a serious claim and it should be taken seriously (as far as burden of proof goes, and in that if it is true, something more needs to be done).

i'm kind of sick, as are a few of the other mods, of being called a "rape apologist", "accomplice to rape", etc just because we're trying to look into this instead of blindly accepting information (that's not to say we think he's innocent). this post (by someone who supposedly knows both ryan and one of the women he raped) kinda of gets across some of our concerns, tho we do have others: http://kellyxvxgreen.blogspot.com/2009/06/why-its-important-for-victim-to-speak.html

i hope you can understand.
22nd-Jun-2009 04:48 pm (UTC) - WOAH
This is turning into hell in a hand basket so fast that it isn't even helping the situation.

First off, pointing fingers at each other is going to help the mod's build a case any faster. It's just hindering it. Instead of yelling "YOU RAPE APOLOGIST!" give more information. Give as much as you have. So far, we've all done a pretty good job of that but the more we can give to the mods, the quicker they come to a decision That's key right now.

Yes, the mods are not handling this the way a lot of us would like to handle the issue, but they are handling it. I would say that handling the situation at all is better than just deleting the post, not issuing a statement like this, and just sweeping it under the rug. They are clearly not doing that. They're leaving the post open so that we can inform them and give our opinions on the situation at hand.

I get that a lot of us are upset that they haven't acted soon. I'm one of those people. However I'm not going to sit here and keep yelling insults when I can give information. So let's start giving information that may help them clear their heads, but stop pointing fingers. Pointing fingers is clearly getting us nowhere as we've done it for four days straight now and nothing has really happened.

Throwing accusations at each other will not help all of us have a clear head to handle the situation and will in fact take time away. Time we need in order to act on this issue and we already wasted four days of it bricking at each other about how this was handled.

Please remember time is key.

Both sides need to drop the anarchist support group issue. That debate has nothing to do with this serious manner at hand. I know dagda_ollathir hasn't mentioned it in a while, however everyone keeps bringing it up and then it gets rehashed.

Again, time is key with this issue and if we keep bringing up this topic, it gets us no where. Our opinions on how to handle rapist is not what's been discussed; it's a possible sexual predator and why the community should post a post about him and why a ban should be in place.

Save that debate for another discussion. We need to get back to what's serious which is Ryan.

So let's save the whole discussion on how it's been handled (or how a group of people handled Ryan) and focus on handling the situation. We wasted a good four days on the how it's been handled. Four days that we let information of a possible sexual predator slip. And while good information has been given, most of what I read is the same debate of how this situation was handled over and over again. This is not helping and it is hindering. Because of this, as far as I'm concerned, we are all hindering the situation, as a community, by not acting quick enough. Both sides. I don't see how screaming and debating at a mod on how this situation was handled is helping just as much as I don't see how not posting information about Ryan is helping.

They're just trying to find out if that the statement that's been posted is true. Someone gave the email of the support group and hopefully they'll hear back from them soon. They are reaching out to people and hope they hear from them as soon as possible.

As we all have pointed out, both sides, this is a heavy situation not to be taken lightly. Just because they're invegistating and not taking the course of action all of us so far would have liked to seen, doesn't mean they're taking the situation lightly. They have to weigh the issue just as we have before making a very weighted decision.

Drop it. What's done is done. We can't change the past. Let's focus on the present which is getting this post posted and that requires us to be direct and give information, not insults. Then we can debate about how the situation was handled so that if, heaven forbid, comes up again we can all handle it better.

Also, can I request another mod to come in? Not that dagda_ollathir is doing a bad job, I just think she needs relief as she's been posting replies on this post and she's been the one doing it for the past four days.

Edited at 2009-06-22 04:51 pm (UTC)
22nd-Jun-2009 04:52 pm (UTC) - Re: WOAH
i've asked another mod to make a post sometime todayish about what we've found so we can be over this issue.
22nd-Jun-2009 05:15 pm (UTC)
Not to bring this post up again...but I find it REALLY disturbing that there have been several deleted posts about Ryan to protect his potential innocence, when Ryan himself had NO QUALMS about airing out his PERSONAL grievances about other members of the Philadelphia AR community (Nick Cooney especially). If you check the philly_veg_out community, there are countless posts where Ryan runs Nick's name through dirt. Why can Ryan post about rubbish when we can't post about his rubbish? Seems foolish to me, especially when he is a potential threat.
22nd-Jun-2009 05:17 pm (UTC)
this isn't the phillly comm, and he hasn't posted those things here. take that up with that community. had ryan posted that here, it would have been deleted and he would have been reprimanded.
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